"laestadian, apostolic, gay, lgbtq, ex-oalc, ex-llc, llc, oalc, bunner" LEARNING TO LIVE FREE: Children of the Heavenly Father

Thursday, May 12, 2005

Children of the Heavenly Father

This is a favorite of mine, a little of which is sung here by Mennonites. It was written by the talented and prolific Swede Carolina Sandell Berg.

Children of the heav’nly Father
Safely in His bosom gather;
Nestling bird nor star in heaven
Such a refuge ne’er was given.

God His own doth tend and nourish;
In His holy courts they flourish;
From all evil things He spares them;
In His mighty arms He bears them.

Neither life nor death shall ever
From the Lord His children sever;
Unto them His grace He showeth,
And their sorrows all He knoweth.

Though He giveth or He taketh,
God His children ne’er forsaketh;
His the loving purpose solely
To preserve them pure and holy.

Lo, their very hairs He numbers,
And no daily care encumbers
Them that share His ev’ry blessing
And His help in woes distressing.

Praise the LORD in joyful numbers:
Your Protector never slumbers.
Rest secure in your Defender
At His will all foes surrender.

43 comments:

  1. That song is a starred song in the OALC hymnal now.
    That means it cannot be sung in church anymore... only at home.
    Maybe because it says "Praise the Lord in joyful numbers"?

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  2. I'm not aware of this practice. Why would a song be acceptable at home but not in church? Any OALC members out there who can shed some light on this?

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  3. Last time the elders were here, about four years ago, they went through the hymnbook and removed some songs (i.e. How Great Thou Art) and starred others (i.e. Amazing Grace, Count Your Many Blessings).
    The starred ones cannot be sung in the service anymore, but are somehow not as dangerous as the ones that have been removed.

    You can't make this stuff up.

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  4. Get out! What is objectionable here?

    Oh Lord my God
    When I in awesome wonder
    Consider all the works
    Thy hands have made
    I see the stars
    I hear the rolling thunder
    Thy power throughout
    The universe displayed

    Then sings my soul
    My Saviour, God, to Thee
    How great thou art
    How great thou art
    Then sings my soul
    My Saviour, God, to Thee
    How great Thou art
    How great Thou art

    When Christ shall come
    With shouts of adulation
    And take me home
    What joy shall fill my heart
    Then I shall bow
    In humble adoration
    And there proclaim My God
    How great Thou art

    Then sings my soul
    My Saviour, God, to Thee
    How great Thou art
    How great Thou art
    Then sings my soul
    My Saviour, God, to Thee
    How great Thou art
    How great Thou art

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  5. For a real treat, listen to Jearlyn Steele at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/jearlyn

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  6. B.t.w. writers last name is Sandell.

    Many of her songs are in finnish OALC hymnal, also this wery nice song.

    b.r. Finnjemmy

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  7. The story I heard was that someone complained that some of the songs sung at church in America were "too melodious" (this means pleasing to the ear because of sweet sounds). When the elders came to the U.S. they advised the preachers to take those songs out. When the preachers asked which ones, the elders told them they would know which ones. Hence, some songs were struck entirely, and others were struck from being sung in church, but are okay to sing at gatherings. There was no outcry from the people that I know of. In fact, I heard some people say that they have full trust and faith in the decisions the preachers make.

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  8. It was Daryl R. in Spearfish who was behind taking all the songs out. The above is correct in that there was NO outcry from the congregation. Ridiculous! Sad.

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  9. They deleted them probably because they were songs that the 'world' sang too.

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  10. Thanks for the spelling correction and the comments. If the OALC abandons all songs written by non-OALC, they will have very little to sing, but it would be more consistent with their doctrine.

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  11. Sure am learning a lot lately from this site. A question about the history--I read through it all, but don't have a clear picture of the succession of preachers for the Brush Prairie group. The names I know are Nyland, Uskoski, Ek, Abernathy, Lindberg, Reidinger. Can anyone clarify who was preaching when the OALC really came into being it's own entity?

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  12. Well, another thing that confirms I made the right choice when I left the OALC.If I were no longer able to sing my praises through my favorite songs, it just wouldn't be the same. As the person I am today, I would never tolerate a preacher telling me which hymns I can sing. Good thing I am FREE to sing whatever my heart desires, no matter where I may be.

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  13. The hymn I most associate with my Laestadian upbringing is the song that was always chanted right before the Lord's Supper:

    O Jumalan Karitsa, joka pois otat maailman synnit: armahda meidän päällemme. O Jumalan Karitsa, joka pois otat maailman synnit: armahda meidän päällemme. O Jumalan Karitsa, joka pois otat maailman synnit: anna meille rauhasi ja siunauksesi.

    My favorite song in the hymnal, though, is "This is my Father's World"

    This is my Father's world, and to my listening ears / all nature sings, and round me rings / the music of the spheres.

    This is my Father's world: I rest me in the thought / of rocks and trees, of skies and seas; / his hand the wonders wrought.

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  14. I'm glad this topic of songs / music has come up. As a "never have been" OALC'er this whole thing music has bothered me about that church. I'm not sure I have a good grasp of the reasons/ rules regarding music/ singing. can someone instruct me? It just seems so sad to me that what is available to me outside their church in the way of music lifting my soul towards the Lord is not available to them. My goodness, wouldn't God, who created our bodies in all its complexities, ENJOY having his children sing to him, accompanies by instruments invented by his CHILDREN'S hands? I know the joyous pride (ooops, shouldn't use that word, huh?) I receive when my own earthly children are happy / joyous when singing their favorite children's songs and playing whatever instrument they can. I can only imagine how it pleases God to have his children praise him WITH instruments. But are you serious, that a certain song won't be sung in teh OALC because it is too pretty to listen to? What am I going to do, then, when I am sitting on my back patio and I hear the sound of water in the background of the melodies of the birds? Does the same apply for the eyes? If it is too pleasing, I can't look at it? Please tell me it is not so.

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  15. BTW, the "it's too melodious" argument doesn't hold water anyway, because there is another song in the hymnal (I think I hear those wedding bells) written by an OALCer to the tune of Amazing Grace.
    They didn't pull that one.
    Same melody.

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  16. Bells -- wedding and otherwise -- are musical instruments. Does this mean it is kosher to sing about musical instruments but not to use them? Perhaps it would be okay to use musical instruments if one plays badly?

    A former member told me she was once paid a visit by an OALC preacher and visitors from Finland who were here for summer meetings. It was likely they had come to recall her to the fold. While chatting over coffee and cookies, however, one of the Finnish visitors spied her piano, went over to it, sat down and began to play beautifully (Beethoven, I think it was). The red-faced preacher ended the evening shortly after.

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  17. Roger,

    Are you the teacher from the other site? I am a teacher also. I live in a very small community in Eastern Washington that has had a huge influx of the OALC in the last 10 years. I'm very concerned, the climate in our school has changed. I would love to visit about your experiences. Can I e-mail you?

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  18. Teachers, I'm very interested in knowing your observations and concerns about your students. This is a safe place to talk about them -- anonymously, of course.

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  19. Yes, same Roger. If you post your email I'll be happy to email. I don't want to post mine here as someone here locally may know it. And, as a teacher, I want to protect my anonimity as I don't want people to think I can not do my job objectively if I have concerns about observations I have made about the OALCers. In fact, many of the children, one on one, are great kids and some of my best relationships come from them. But I want to know more about them and their religion and what makes them tick. Again, can anyone answer my questions from my previous post about the rules of music / songs. Why instruments can't be used, etc.

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  20. To the teacher above: hymns are sung in the church, at the beginning of the service, after the prayer, after LLL's sermon is read, and at the end. They have a small songbook with both Finnish and English hymns, all of which are either approved or disapproved (then struck) to be used. Musical instruments are preached to be a sin and taking lessons is not acceptable. It is considered to be worldly and would only bring honor to the musician. There are no musical instruments, handbells, or choirs in the OALC. That's it.

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  21. I guess we can chat here, and share our experiences with all. For the most part, I very much enjoy the OALC children I have in class. The girls are far more polite than the boys. We seem to have trouble with groups of boys being disrespectful to adults. They hang together in groups and appear to be very angry and resentful. As an educator, it is difficult to figure out what they can participate in and what they can't. There are no set rules. Alternate activities are difficult for us to provide. I also worry about losing some of the important programs we have for the non-OALC students because our numbers are getting so high, music, athletics and other activities may not be an option.

    I have been visiting these sights for over a year to try to get some understanding of what I am dealing with. Unfortunately, it just makes me more sad about the situation for my students and our community. I encourage them and am friendly, loving and supportive so that they will not think worldlies are bad.

    I have to admit I am somewhat nervous posting on this sight for fear of being found out. Why, I'm not sure. It is an unusual feeling and I admire those of you that have had the guts to leave. I can't imagine how hard it must be. My hat is off to you!!!

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  22. Thank you for the post. Don't worry about being "found out" -- you are safe here. It grieves me that some of those students are probably my nieces and nephews. Thank you for trying to understand them and help them.

    In my experience as an OALC kid, any difficulties at school were blamed on "wordly" teachers and staff. Some OALC parents consider school primarily a legal obligation. Their boys will go into the construction trades and learn on the job while their girls will marry young and have large families. So what's the point of learning history, math, music, literature? A sad logic and not at all "Laestadian" . . .

    As for your school losing programs, can you strategize with your principal about this threat? In my experience, OALC parents are not active in lobbying of any kind and there is strong respect in the church for the separation of church and state. But if you receive funding based on student participation, you may indeed have a problem. I don't know if OALC parents contribute to school fundraisers. Kinda doubt it.

    Self-pride is the big OALC bugbear -- perhaps some parents would allow their kids to take drama, art, music and sports as long as the kids did not perform in front of an audience? A long shot, but worth trying . . .

    On another topic, is there any way teachers can educate OALC students about their ethnic heritage? For example, biology teachers might ask students to write about Laestadius as a botanist. History teachers can explore the Sami, and Finnish immigration. As a music teacher, perhaps you could explore joiking and Lutheran hymnody . . . By exploring the actual history of Lastadianism, your students might be able to see it more clearly and develop a healthy respect for differences of other kinds.

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  23. I love this song, that is one thing I miss about the church, the singing was the only part that made it bearable. I was so saddened when I hard that they removed so many songs.

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  24. Is the "O Jumalan Karitsa" hymn still always sung in Finnish in all OALC congregations? I wonder why they haven't translated that one? It is a hymn that brings a lot of memories from numerous Lutheran communions because it is also sung in the Lutheran churches of Finland, Sweden and Norway. Very nice words.

    That hymn might very well be the thing I'll miss the most from Lutheran services as I'm about to join the Orthodox church now. The hymn is called Agnus Dei in Latin and it was taken into use at church services in the Roman/Western church so late that the Western and Eastern christianity had already split, at least to some extent, so the Orthodox church never adopted the use of the hymn in its communion services.

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  25. Thank you for posting, "cousin" Theo. Would you be so kind to translate "O Jumalan Karitsa" for us when you have time? This song's contemplative air makes it ideal for communion. I miss it too.

    (Many blessings on your decision to the join the Orthodox church. I hope you will consider posting about your journey of faith.)

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  26. If "O Jumalan Karitsa" is the Agnus Dei, then the words are a Finnish rendering of:

    Lamb of God, you take away the sin of the world, have mercy on us.
    Lamb of God, you take away the sin of the world, have mercy on us.
    Lamb of God, you take away the sin of the world, grant us peace.

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  27. Thanks "cousin" free2beme! I will consider your suggestion...

    Tomte, your version of the Agnus Dei is the same that is used in the Evangelical Lutheran Church of Finland. There are two small differences compared to the old one still used by OALC. For the first, the OALC version says "the sins of the world" (=plural). And for the second, at the end it says "grant us your peace and blessing".

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  28. To my fellow teacher: I too have experienced the "groups" of boys being disrespectful and threatening to the other kids. However, this year we have a group of the girls that are very challenging to some teachers. Usually they are sweet and quiet. But there are a few bringing others into their dissention, backbiting, rumoring, and disrespect to the adults. As a male, I have no problem dealing with the boys. It is different for our female teachers. The boys give them a hard time. But what scares me as a male is the girls who can be vindictive and hold a grudge for a perceived wrong done to them. I know this is not specific to OALCer's, but this year's group has some tough girls. The boys, however, their "gang" mentality is more specific to the OALC in our school. We have small pockets of "worldies" who have their friends they mainly associate with, but the Large groups of AL are intimidating to all the kids and even to adults. I am a friendly teacher and get along with most everyone. But I don't even dare approach a circle of OAL boys due to the rude glares, silence, and disrepect. When in groups, if you say "Hi" or try to carry on a conversation, they act like you are an alien (maybe in their group they have to put up a front with their peers to not seem to friendly to a worldy). I heard one girl recently call most of the kids that go to her school "white trash". Maybe she is talking about their "sinful" ways, I don't know. But it came off as very judgemental. Just sharing my experienecs. But remember, there are many great AL kids!
    One more thing: I know there is the stereotype that AL girls get married young and have lots of kids. How much of that is taught by the church, and how specifically? Also, what is the tendency for these girls to have premarital sex? Would it be as high a percentage as the "world", more, or less?

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  29. ALC parent (NOT OLD)5/17/2005 02:50:00 PM

    Hi to all ~ I just wanted to comment to the teachers... I don't know where you teach exactly, but I was curious, do you have Old ALC kids, and ALC kids? Or are you aware that there are 2 different churches? SW Washington has a big congregation of both. Anyways, I thought I'd try to give some info on the ALC branch. With music we're fairly "normal" :-) Depending of course on who you know. We have an organ in church, and many know how to play. We don't use any other instruments in our Sunday or other worship services, but other functions... weddings, funerals etc may use other instruments though I believe our Pastor needs to give it the "okay". Many of our children participate in band. You will however run across families that attend this branch who are much more restricted. (no band, sports, tv etc.) That however is their personal choice. Our pastor doesn't preach a "set of rules ". Education though is still lagging behind as far as the general young audience being encouraged to go to additional school etc. The boys especially, are attracted to the money that can be made NOW in construction rather than thinking about 20 years down the road when they're getting old and tired out! :) The school my children attend doesnt' have a big ALC pop from either church, so I don't see the "group/gang" part. (HEard of it though). Actually my kids are good friends with an OALC family. I like that they have similar values, though they have other friends who do too.
    Well enough for now. I am curious though to know if you were aware of the difference between churches. Thanks and God Bless ...

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  30. This is the English translation my church sings for O Jumalan Karitsa.

    Behold the Lamb of God, Which taketh away the sin of the world; Upon u s grant Thy Mercy.

    Behold the Lamb of God, Which taketh away the sin of the world; Upon us grant Thy mercy.

    Behold the Lamb of God, Which taketh away the sin of the world; Give us Thy Peace and Blessing.

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  31. This is the English translation my church sings for O Jumalan Karitsa.

    Behold the Lamb of God, Which taketh away the sin of the world; Upon u s grant Thy Mercy.

    Behold the Lamb of God, Which taketh away the sin of the world; Upon us grant Thy mercy.

    Behold the Lamb of God, Which taketh away the sin of the world; Give us Thy Peace and Blessing.

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  32. I was taught in the OALC that musical instruments were wrong because they came from Cain and that they are not spoken of in the NT. (exoalcer - can you think of any place in the NT where they are mentioned?) No where though in the Bible does it say that they are wrong. One of God's favorite people - King David - played the harp beautifully and soothed King Saul with his playing. Since God is the same yesterday, today and eternally meaning He does NOT change then instruments can't be a sin.

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  33. Telephones are not mentioned in the Bible either.

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  34. To add to the above post it is the same with jewelry. How can jewelry be a sin when in Ezekiel 16 God (who is comparing Jerusalem to a bride - His bride) decks her out in gold and silver and necklaces, earrings, bracelets, etc. and thinks she is beautiful. If He considered jewelry a sin then He would not have made that analogy and He does not change. Same as when Jesus' first miracle was changing water into wine. If wine was such a sin (drunkedness is talked about - not drinking a little wine) Jesus would not have made that His first miracle-which of course signifies the blood He would soon shed. Paul tells Timothy in 1 Tim 5:23 to not drink water only, but to use a 'little' wine for the sake of his ailments and stomach. If it were such a horrendous sin then Paul would not have told a young preacher/teacher to use it. I don't like the stuff myself, but I no longer judge people to hell if I see that they have a glass of wine with dinner.

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  35. Actually, I was told by some older OALC people long ago that when the telephone first came out it was preached a sin. They must have seen it as a potential gossip instrument. Whatever.

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  36. About the question regarding the use of instruments in the New Testament... no, instruments are not referred to specifically for use in worship services in the New Testament. But, if one had a bit of common sense, you could conclude that they were used for a couple of reasons.
    1> Jewish tradition had a rich heritage of using instruments. David (as previously mentioned) was not only a shepherd but a harpist, and he wrote music, called Psalms and considered divinely inspired. The Psalms command worshippers to use instruments in praise and worship the Lord. Jesus was a Jew. The early church often taught in the synagogues.
    2> Because it is not mentioned that there was a new ban on instrumental music, we can presume that there were instruments present. The absence of commandments regarding musical instruments in the NT is actually a better defense for the use of them than against. As you said, Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever.
    I think we can make an assumption that there were instruments present at the return party of the prodigal son. The music was heard from afar off. Presumably, it was not O Jumalan Karitsa sung a capella (nothing against the beautiful Latvian choir).

    Also, when my Lord returns we will hear a trumpet sound.

    I think it is a sin to have so many gifted musicians stifled by man-made rules.

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  37. I have always refgerred to my self as a, half-breed, my father is OALC and my mother is worldly. (divorced, of course) I went to school in one of Clark County's biggest districts and the one with the largest population of OALC students. I had a unique perspective since I saw them at church and at school and as far as the boys go, they act the same at church as they do in public. I have learned over the years though that a lot of their behavior is defensive, they know they are different and that people talk about them and think they are weird. This is preached about a lot at church, I have heard preachers talk about "their women" being called bunheads. I know that they can be rude and disrespectful, but some of that is fear and uncertainty. There was a change going on shortly after I graduated and the kids were getting bolder and not quite as shy maybe things have got worse since I left. I feel bad for the kids, some of them are my cousins and I have two siblings in high school. Also, I remember in grade school when we had square-dancing in P.E. all the OALC kids would bring notes and be excused from participating, I just didn't tell my Dad, I loved it.

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  38. It's weird how the OACLer's are so proud and boastfull when they talk about how their church never changes. I have heard that so many times! Doesn't taking some of the WELL known songs in the church taken out count as change??

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  39. To ALC Parent,
    The students I teach are OALC. I heard there was a difference, thanx for clarifying. This is a very small school district and our numbers are growing rapidly which is beginning to change our school culture. Change is always scary, especially when we are unsure about the nature of the group (is it a cult?) we are becoming inundated with.

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  40. By almost all definitions of a cult the OALC qualifies. We have been through this discussion here before. Look up old posts. There is no question that it is one.

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  41. I have been on this, and other sites for many months. I have read everything I can find. I am very greatful for these sites. Some people seem to still question whether it is or isn't a cult. I'm not here to judge, just to help my students and community gain knowledge about the culture.

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  42. Why doesn't the OALC have their own school? The way they feel about Worldlies, you would think they would want to keep their children away.

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  43. Just curious. When these songs are disqualified, do they have to ask for forgiveness for singing them before? It doesn't seem fair to take away songs that may have deep meaning and memories for some of the people. There are some songs I can close my eyes and have fond memories of something that took place when it was being sung.

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